It's Personal Stories, A Hospitality Podcast

Tedd Evers, Global Partner Leader, Travel and Hospitality AWS interviewed by Dorothy Dowling

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Dorothy Dowling interviews Tedd Evers, Global Partner, Lead for Travel and Hospitality at AWS, discussing his career journey, leadership during crises, prioritization, and future innovations in hospitality. Tedd emphasizes curiosity, agile thinking, empathy, personal balance, and the critical role of data strategy in transforming the industry.

Dorothy Dowling:

Greetings. I am Dorothy Dowling and welcome to its Personal Stories, a hospitality podcast dedicated to empowering professionals Through the lived experience of inspiring industry leaders, this is a platform for learning, leadership, and personal transformation. Today I am honored to be joined by Ted Ever. Global partner, lead, travel, and hospitality at AWS Ted's career reflects a remarkable blend of vision, execution, and heart. From pioneering in innovation and travel distribution to launching his own tech ventures and now guiding global partnerships at one of the world's most transformative companies. He brings a rare perspective, grounded in depth and breadth. He's also a compelling speaker. A devoted husband and a proud girl dad to a college student. Ted, it's a true privilege to have you with us today.

Tedd Evers:

It's wonderful to be here with you, Dorothy. Thank you.

Dorothy Dowling:

Wonderful. Ted, let's start at the beginning. I would love to hear what inspired your journey into travel and technology and what ultimately led you to focus on partnerships within the hospitality space?

Tedd Evers:

Wow. I guess any origin story probably has a lot of. Of childhood stories that are seemingly innocuous at the time, but in, in hindsight, turned out to be pretty impactful. So mine is no different in that respect. And I, I credit my father and just, we moved around a lot as a family, and I remember as a young boy just sitting down and, laying down in the front seat of the car while he's driving overnight in these long distance trips and. You are working out the map and the next destination with him. And that really inspired a joy not only of maps, but of just learning about the world and everything that's out there. And and he took us, we were very fortunate to have traveled my younger sister and I to Europe with our parents when we were younger. Much to the chagrin of our older siblings I might add. But that really opened our eyes to just be, in, in, in JFK and seeing people from around the world and in different clothes and different cultures, and being exposed to that at a young age really had a profound impact on me. And I didn't really activate it, in a sense until I, I made a pretty life-changing move and left a corporate sales job and bought around the world ticket and traveled around the world for a year, and that really cemented. The idea and the desire to create a career within travel and hospitality.

Dorothy Dowling:

I, I have heard that story, Ted and I know how engaging it is. I'm just wondering if we could talk a little bit about the career and the kinds of things that have really helped you in terms of leading and solving problems.'cause you are brilliant at that. So I would love for you to share your wisdom with our audience.

Tedd Evers:

Thanks. I think so that really, that, that trip really was the initiative or the impetus really for getting involved in travel and coming back. I actually wanted to be a travel rider. This is before the age influencers, so I was, and I was doing a lot of travel riding and a small startup called Site 59 came knocking at the door and I actually signed up to be a writer. They found out I had a lot of these business development sales skills. So I wound up. Working with hotels direct and directly contracting hotels for a company that didn't exist yet and trying to get a outrageous discount for a non established player. So you, being in the industry a long time, I'm sure you know how that played out, but it was an incredible learning experience and we had a great leadership team there, ultimately required by Travelocity. And the rest is history, but that, that was really the start of my career. And then in, in terms of. Of really big, impactful events. I think learning, I mean it's, I won't quote, we have the wisdom of looking back on some very difficult times within the industry, right? So at site 59 we went through nine 11 and, had to fight through that. And then and then just more recently through, through COVID, I had to guide my own business through that. So going through those challenges really. Influence and I think taught me a lot about leadership how to solve problems, how to navigate those difficult times because it's really, you can, it's not autopilot, but when things are fun and good and everything is growing it's a little bit easier to do business deals. But when things are tough, that's when you really find out, how strong are your relationships? How value is your technology? How can you help customers in a way with their challenges that they're facing.

Dorothy Dowling:

I appreciate you sharing all those defining moments, and I know there's an awful lot of literature speaking about adaptive leadership today and how you flex in those kinds of environments, and I'm just wondering what some of those applications bring to your role today in terms of some of those adaptive leadership skills.

Tedd Evers:

Sure. One thing is that given the rapid pace of change of technology, being able to deal with ambiguity and uncertainty, particularly now even. And we add that every day is cyclical, but being able to adapt and be able to thrive in those particular situations is probably the biggest lesson. And a lot of it goes back to some of the basics, right? Is un understanding where customers are, where your partners are, listening to them and being able to adapt and respond to what their needs are. And in furtherance of your organization's business goals.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah I was reading an article yesterday and I just think your background in sales and just your global understanding of the world, Ted but it is that listening skill and it is being highly vested in others and learning from them and knowing that we don't have the answers, but we're going to figure it out together, I think is this. Stage that we find ourselves with all the change that is going on in the world that we're living in. I'm wondering if we can talk a little bit about the performance environments.'cause you've worked in a lot of very high performance, very demanding environments. You've been an entrepreneur, you're a global leader today. You were a global leader when I first met you. So I'm just wondering how you manage your time and priorities given all the different things that seem to be important every day.

Tedd Evers:

Sure. We're all waiting and maybe closer now to the time when technology will give us all more leisure time back. I hope so. So there's obviously a lot of productivity tools and in all seriousness, I think every organization now is seeing how they can leverage generative AI and other tools to really be more productive and focus on things. And we could talk a little bit more about that. But in terms of so just the pace of life has increased so much. And it's really hard to. To prioritize when everything is a priority. And we're working with global matrix teams and there's different time zones and everyone's gonna have a, their priority and they want to make their priority. Your priority. So one of the things that has been helpful is to a, is to ruthlessly prioritize. And you have to be very firm about what your focus and priorities are and stick to them. And you do have to say no, it's the hardest thing because. In any organization, you want to build relationships and earn trust, as we say, at Amazon. But at the same time, you need to deliver results. Another core leadership principle that we have. So you have to focus, and I think one of the one one of my managers years ago, he had a really interesting way of putting it. And I still use it today. And he says, focus on the critical few. So no matter what situation you're in, if you just take a time to, to step back. And to really align what those initiatives are those actions that you have, those tasks that you have with what that overall larger business purpose is and your vision. And if you just take a step back and then think through how those align, I think the, that can help sort it out. It's not the ultimate, there's always gonna be balancing and trade-offs of priorities, but I think really focusing on those few things because. Whether you're running your own business or whether you're in a larger organization, if you focus on those critical core priorities you really can't go wrong. It's when you start to get bogged down to things that don't really add value, that gets people into trouble, I think, and it's very easy just given the ease with which, you know, tasks and priorities can come across that desk.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah, I think that's a really nice framework to assess, kind of prioritization to.'cause I agree with you. Most of us are highly vested in people and relationships and supporting others, and it is very difficult to say no. But I do think that mindset of. Really prioritizing around the critical few is a good framework for our audience to learn from you. So thank you. I'm wondering if we can talk a little bit about how you manage sort of your own personal energy.'cause you've had a very demanding career. You travel. A lot you have worked around the globe and it's always hard to balance sort of your energy and making sure you're bringing your best self to all the people that depend on you. So do you have any tips there that you would share with our audience in terms of how you balance all of those personal priorities?

Tedd Evers:

Sure. I was fortunate to, to have a daughter, right? So having a family will certainly help help you prioritize and, being able to honor those commitments and be there for your family, certain, certainly an important thing for anyone no matter where they are. And that usually helps put a good perspective on things just as a general table stakes, no matter what's happening. But for me personally, I just make sure that I am. That I'm keeping myself healthy and balanced in terms of exercise. During COVID, like many people, I started walking outside a lot more, and that's something that has continued on to this day. So I'm fortunate to have, a wooded area close by to my house that I can access, but. Being able to carve out that time for yourself because, and that goes back to the ruthless prioritization as well, because if you do have to put yourself first.'cause if you are not at your best, you're not going to be giving your organization, your startup, your company your partners, your family. Your best. So it is up to it. It could sound counterintuitive, but you do need to really put yourself first and make sure that you are able to perform at your best in all those interactions and do it that may be different things for different people. So for me it could just be walking outside. I still play basketball. I bike, I, and then obviously spending time with family is super important and being able to do those really gives a good balance, I think. To whatever demanding type of activity. And obviously there's gonna be trade offs in every scenario, but having that perspective, carving out even just a small amount of time to take a mental break if you can't escape your desk and take a deep breath and to try to reset so that you can't be your best self.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. I know that's been part of my personal journey too, is understanding how to find some of those personal times to just re recharge and really bring your best self.'cause I think a lot of times we lose sight of that because we become em, we become immersed in projects and prioritize different work elements. So thank you for sharing that. I'm wondering if we can talk a little bit about problem solving and critical thinking, because you talked about listening, you are an extraordinary listener and you're really good at working with others and helping them become better at those kinds of things. So I'm just wondering if you could share any of your thought leadership around how do you become such a great listener?

Tedd Evers:

First of all, thank you for the compliment. I could think of some people who might disagree with you but we're always trying to get better, right? Yeah. Actually one of, one of my, in, earlier in my career I went through the Xerox sales training program. They had a specific course just on listening, so there. Some certain mechanics there that you, I'm sure everyone has heard of. You wanna make sure that you're focusing on the person that you're listening to and really, testing for understanding, asking clarifying questions. But it's really about being engaged and being able to be attentive and present in that particular moment. And because of the pace of work that we're all going through, all of our interactions can become transactional very quickly. And it's really about being present in that moment and that. It has to do not just when you're engaging or interacting with someone, but when you are on your own right. When you are doing your work. So it, it is connected, but so asking those questions and, reading back to someone, Hey, listen, this is what I heard you say. Am I correct? That shows that you're engaged, but also that you take away the correct communication and message that person wants to have. And then there's some other, some, we have our own psychological biases and. Often we're very quick to react to what someone is saying, and that's never been more true than in today's media culture. When we think about it, when we have a headline that immediate immediately might set us off for whatever reason. And I think the other analogy that I like to use or phrase is just to, to respond and not react. And I think those are two very distinct things, right? A reaction is something that's a knee jerk. It's a quick, it's that proverbial, firing off a nasty email to respond based on someone, on what you think that person might be said when email, of course, is a medium that can't convey emotion or anything like that. So you basically, you, the recipient reads into it however they're feeling. So instead of reacting, taking that moment and respond, a response is by its very nature considered and thought out. And we often, obviously there's gonna be scenarios where you need a quick yes or no, or someone just needs information. And I don't wanna be a bottleneck. So you wanna respond very quickly, and obviously it depends on the context and the person, but a response is very different than a reaction. I think part of listening is being able to craft a response based on what that person is saying so that you're addressing and communicating more effectively.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah. I love that. Tim, I do think that in today's world that is extraordinarily important for us to think about responding and not reacting. I'm wondering if you can talk a little bit about the kind of pressure that many executives are under today and how fast this world is moving. If there's anything you can give in terms of guidance about how executives navigate some of that high pressured, make a decision now kind of environment.

Tedd Evers:

Yeah I think number one, it's to, to stay curious, and I bring that up only because of the rapid pace of change, right? A, as a leader, you're not necessarily expected to know all the details, but all the different, LLM models that are coming out in generative AI on a daily basis or not, right? But you are expected to ask the questions. That can lead to the answers and understand how any technology, any initiative can fit in with your overall vision. So I think the first one is to be curious and to learn and to ask those right questions to understand how things might impact. The other one is to, we have another, aspect of our leadership principles at Amazon is to dis-confirm your own beliefs. So we all have, and especially individuals like you and I where we have, years of experience in the industry we can usually answer a lot of questions and we know things intuitively that we gained over the years, but at the same time, we're also smart enough to know that we don't know everything. And that's why we continually seek to learn more about whether it's a new technology, new initiative. So I think being able to do that, to handle the, I should say, the more short term vicissitudes. While maintaining that long-term focus. And I think too many leaders, too many people today get caught up in the short term the here and now. And it's obviously, it's important to remain present, but you need to think about things long-term. How is this going to help us and will this be something significant in the long term? And a lot of times you won't know the answer and you're gonna have to use your judgment that you've gained over the years to do that. But it's really hard to think of when we have, companies that are focusing on quarterly results, a rapid pace of change with generative ai. We saw board level mandates to just, two years ago where they didn't care what, just do something with generative AI because we're nervous about it, right? And we need to do something. And of course, that's evolved now and people are focusing on the ROI and the specific use cases, et cetera. But it's not just, again, not just respon reacting. But it's responding. It's thinking about things in a long term. And sometimes we also say, we're willing to be misunderstood for long periods of time. Sometimes you might have a view or a principle or a vision that might not match or mesh with the spirit of the day, right? The technology. Whatever the zeitgeist is at the moment, or the meme I should say. But if you are focused on a long-term vision, and you're willing to take those bets and you can communicate that obviously'cause you need to to get short-term short-term pressures. I think that's really important to and obviously that involves communication skills.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah. I think that's a really, again, a significant framing for everyone to be balancing the short and the long-term and have that long-term vision, certainly within their framing of their decision making, and then of course, building some of that communication around it so that you can. Keep others with you, Ted. But I also really loved the expression of just confirming your own beliefs because I think as someone like you that has been involved in the industry for a long time, we have to be open to sometimes that. Our beliefs may need to evolve. And so pushing that, pushing ourselves to think differently is always good as well. So thank you. Absolutely. One of the things that I admire about you, Ted, and I think you know this, is that I think you're one of the most gifted storytellers that I've had the privilege of being in the room. I think you captivate audiences because you bring clarity, you bring heart. I love some of the stories you have told about your global journey when you took that bet and quit your job. And, how that influenced your personal life as well as your professional life. But I'm just wondering if there's any guidance,'cause so many of our listeners are put into situations where they have to be on stage, they have to engage an audience. They might have to be presenting to clients. I'm just wondering what kind of advice you might offer to them in terms of how you have become such an accomplished public speaker.

Tedd Evers:

Oh thank you again. And I think the first bit is that it is a journey and I think we. And actually recently, within the last few months, they, we had a speaking a speaking class, right? With all the diff the various speakers that we have across the organization to be able to learn what are some of the techniques, what you should focus on, and how to improve. And so I think it, it is a journey. And then there was a, I think the beginning of the session, there was a quote, I believe it was Mark Twain. I don't know, I might, I may have this outta context, but it said there are two types of people in the world. There, there are those who are those who are nervous, and those who are liars. So you're always gonna be nervous no matter what. But that's part of what gets us in. Whether you're a performer, whether you're an athlete, anything that's part of that adrenaline and what gets you going, that's a good sign.'cause that means that you care. But the other piece is I think we, we all have, our society has a vision of what we think a speaker should be, and it's important to, to be yourself. And because when you start to be scripted. And even if you're, so I had the good fortune when I was running my own company. I had very, a very wide range of things that I could talk about and topics and discuss. When you're in a larger organization, there are certain messages that you wanted to convey as an organization and you need to do that. But how do you do that in a way that's not scripted? And it doesn't sound like you're just reading from a, reading from a teleprompter or something like that. In some cases you need to do that, of course, but it's so it's be yourself and put your own personal spin or take on it. I can recall being, and then just also li as a conference goer, as an attendee, listening to and taking note of some of the things that other speakers are doing that, that you might want to incorporate. But to your point earlier it's all about telling stories in the end. And if it's not a compelling story, if you're just, reading bullet points off a slide, it's not gonna resonate with anyone. So I would say, be yourself, be conversational and obviously know your audience and understand what they want to hear what they might want to hear. And anticipate those and think of it. Not even though you might be speaking. So by definition, maybe a monologue. It's actually a conversation and I think if you think of it in terms of having a conversation with the audience, engaging them with eye contact, but also obviously with helping them provoke thoughts and ask questions that can get them thinking and engaged. I think tho those are some of the things that have helped me at.

Dorothy Dowling:

I like everything that you've just shared shared with us. Ted and I do think it is a humanity that you always bring. You always bring a little bit of the personal element of Ted to the audience and understand how to connect some of the personal learnings that you've had and bring it into the business application world. And I think that's always why I've been so engaged with you, because you've had an incredible background just in terms of your education and the kinds of work that you've done and the way that you have traveled and been engaged with very significant leaders around the world. But you always bring it down on a very human level and connect with people where it matters. So I think it's that heart that you bring to that storytelling. So I do that element about being conversational. I do expect that you put an enormous amount of time thinking through how to connect with that audience and bring some of those stories forward. So thank you for sharing that.

Tedd Evers:

Yeah,

Dorothy Dowling:

go ahead. Sorry. I would add,

Tedd Evers:

yeah, and you mentioned preparation I think I'm quoting other people here all the time, Winston Churchill said, it takes an hour to, 15 minutes to prepare for an hour long speech and then an hour to prepare for a 15 minute long speech. So it is, it does involve that preparation and being able to be concise and really internalize what the message that you're trying to convey.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah. For absolutely. And I do think a lot of people underestimate the amount of time it takes and it's a journey to prepare as well as deliver, deliver the content. So I'm wondering if we could talk a little bit about the future hospitality, because you and I obviously are immersed in this industry, but it's a very traditional one. And I look at, I've been in this industry myself, Ted, more than 40 years, but I think about the last few years as being the most significant in terms of transformation. So I'm just wondering, when you think about the next three to five what do you think are the greatest opportunities for innovation in our industry?

Tedd Evers:

So I think within hospitality the big opportunity here is to really and we've talked about this before, is to be able to. Deliver hospitality at scale. And what I mean by that is leveraging the technology that's out there so that you can have more time to, to deliver hospitality. Everyone thinks of, when you think of the front desk, right? You're walking up to a front desk, there's a person there, but their heads down, they're at a screen. Or they may maybe on the phone. Wouldn't you rather be able to handle those in a more automated fashion that still deliver important, guest satisfaction experiences, but have that person be there to welcome the guest as they arrive? And we think of it, I think of it as a shift from a front desk to a front door. When someone arrives at your house, you're knocking and say, Hey, what's going on? You're gonna have your head down on the phone. Sadly, some people probably will still do that, but, but so I think you think of that analogy and leveraging technology so that you can deliver what it truly means to be hospitable on a human one-to-one level, and to have that connection that and that can happen whether it's a guest facing technology, it can happen whether it's, back of the house or whether it's employee facing or staff facing, so they can be more productive. I love some things that have been done. It's some of the chains that we've seen some of our customers where they're able to, to tip staff using a QR code, right? Because there, there's so many people, there's so many touch points when you're at a hotel, when you're at a lodge, when you're at a resort. And so many people there and they're taking care of you. And the ability to be able to just give them a tip, like on the spot without having to worry about denominations or being a foreign country know what, having the right change and all that thing, that could be a challenge. I'd love just a simple technology like that to and what that ties into the larger thing of removing all of those friction points in a guest stay, whether that's checking, whether that's checkout, whether it's finding out the, the best restaurant or bar nearby. All of those things, I think is just what makes it so exciting. And obviously with all of the artificial intelligence, all the data that opens up the path for better personalization to anticipate needs. Because that's ultimately what true hospitality is anticipating your needs before you ask for them. Those are some of the things that I think will be enabled, and I think it, it will happen faster than we think. I know that we've. We're still in a, an industry where we're doing some things manually that, that maybe should not be done but I do think that we're on the precipice of some significant changes.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah, no, I agree with you Ted. And I do think the speed of how some of those things are gonna actually be adopted and really make a difference is going to happen much more quickly than we anticipate. I know AWS is at the forefront of so much of this, in particular when it comes down to cloud and data strategy. I'm just wondering how you see all of those pieces, the analytics, the automation, personalization, if there's anything that you see is going to be transformative in terms of how we engage customers.

Tedd Evers:

Sure. I think it, it all boils down to, if you want to think of a common denominator, I would say having a data strategy, right? Because a lot of people I think the message is that has gotten out there now, that you can't really leverage all of these great tools, all of these AI tools, if your data is not in order necessarily. I think understanding what all those data points are and what the important ones are, right? So not getting down again in, in trying to capture everything, but what are the important, data points that you need to capture. How can you leverage those? How can you work with partners to deliver better experiences? You look at how hotel brands and airlines have collaborated on their loyalty programs to deliver promotions or to address and segment certain markets. Being able to share that and having the technology that enables that, that sharing is important. But also to be able to, and obviously to be able to do it in a way that's privacy friendly, that's secure above all else in, in today's environment and having that strategy so that it's not just a matter of Okay I've created the state warehouse of the state of lake. And it's not just a matter of, okay, I, I can. I have someone's email and I can send a personalized email. It's more about having a more holistic view of that customer and not necessarily just with their particular interactions with you, but with other brands that are adjacent to you to make that overall experience much more frictionless and much more seamless. So it's having that data strategy and being able to have more of a contextual view. Of the guest no matter where they are. And I think, that starts even at the property level because I think many properties can't, they don't see, I might not, I might be at a brand for the first time and I'm not part of their loyalty program, but every time I go to a property, I'm probably, I'm spending X and F and B. And if that particular property can't even see. That, that interaction or that behavior, whatever, they might, because I'm not a loyalty member, maybe I don't rate as highly, but I'm a valuable guest nonetheless. So that's an individual property level. Even being able to have that data set and that view of the customer's importance. So that would be the one underlying thing I think to get right and to obviously have that, that unified view of the guests or the traveler that we've all been. Pursuing for so long.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah, no, I think that's really brilliant and I do think that prioritization on the critical few that you spoke about earlier and really investing in that strategic view in terms of what's important from a data point of view is something that hospitality and I agree with you, it's the layers of everyone that is. Part of that experience that has to understand what is going to be most important to us, really improving the customer engagement.

Tedd Evers:

And it's not just the domain of your IT staff, right? Absolutely. Every business leader needs to understand, have a data strategy and work in partnership with the IT group to, to deliver that for guests.

Dorothy Dowling:

And that really leads me to this next question because there's so many conversations around what commercial leadership is evolving to, and I think that siloed framework that you were just talking about, the technology and the folks that are driving top line and the integration I'm just wondering if there are particular skills or mindsets that you would offer to the audience in terms of what does that next generation of commercial leadership really look like?

Tedd Evers:

I think number one, it's agility and as I mentioned before, being able to deal with ambiguity. So when you think of agile frameworks, again, that typically comes from a development side of the house, right? So instead of the traditional, what we would call a waterfall, where you're planning out, we're going to do this and it's gonna be in these stages, and that's where it goes being more agile doing smaller experiments, learning as you go along and all have that be based on. Not what we think will work, but on actual customer feedback and getting that as soon as possible in the development process, the lifecycle development process, no matter if it's a software product or a business process, right? So that, I think agility is the number one, the one trait there. And then the other thing is just is really empathy with your teammates and really understanding them. And what motivates them. And not looking at a workforce as a monolithic thing and a particular role as one specific thing, but look at that individual and what motivates that individual. And being able to do that is really I think what leadership is all about to bring the best. And I think if you look in like a sports analogy, the best coaches will do that because not everyone is gonna need the same type of motivation or coaching or guidance or leadership. And then the other thing is that even if you're a leader you learn a lot from your team. Having them, giving them the wherewithal and the empowerment to conduct those experiments on their own, to come up with their own and to really present and share with them. And obviously a lot of that will come with the responsibility as well. But that's ultimately what, what can help engender growth. And really I think in the end, I think workers say they wanna work on something that's meaningful, whether it's, if you, classic, developer developers wanna work on a project that's really interesting and creative and something that can have that ownership. So being able to grant ownership of a particular task or initiative or something to those individual teammates I think is really important.

Dorothy Dowling:

There's a couple of through lines that I really loved about what you offered there, Ted, and that, brought back to when I spoke with a recruiter about. Two of the areas that he really likes to find in talent, one is around people that have some kind of an athletic background because that understanding of how to work within a team is something that's really honed through experiences of being an athlete. The second was really what you spoke to earlier about that sales discipline and really being customer obsessed, but understanding. You know how to really approach that in a very disciplined way. But I love the way you brought that forward in terms of connecting the dots. And I do think traditionally that technology and some of the folks that drive top line, there's always been friction. And I do think that element of understanding that we are a holistic team and we've gotta have the empathy and work together and understand that mutual goal and approaching to how we achieve those goals together is. Is really important. I wonder if we can talk a little bit about talent. I love the stories that you tell about your daughter, but, and I'm sure you're a tremendous coach and advisor to her, but if you were talking to high potential talent today in the hospitality industry, what kind of advice would you offer to them to stretch and grow into leadership roles?

Tedd Evers:

Yeah. We don't have enough time for me to speak about my father that for for another time. But I think it's really it is to to stay curious, right? And to learn. And not just and that I think is also, there's so much that it's implied in that, right? So just staying current and being able to understand and leverage how technologies like generative AI can help you. And it's not, you don't have to take a course, you don't have to take a certification. That's great if you do, but it's literally applying it now today. In whatever you're doing. So I think, and that's like the new paradigm of learning is not necessarily, course-based which it still is. I do believe in it, and that's, there's a time and place for that. But it's what are you doing on an a daily basis, on an individual experimentation? These smaller experiments that you can learn from and iterate and share with your team. And regardless of where you are within an organization or what you're working on, there are always gonna be opportunities for that. And if you if you I'm not gonna say I'm thinking of breaking bad where he says, apply yourself to Jesse. If you apply yourself, if you're able to do that, no matter what role you're in, there is something to learn. And you also learn of what you may not like. That can guide you in, in, in your career. So I think that's important. And then, and. Listening to others. And another phrase I always share with my younger sister is we joke about it. We say, just talk to people. And it's literally just being curious and having a conversation. Learning from other people in the organization for in or out, or anyone about what they do. Asking questions, being curious and listening and taking away that nugget that can help you. So you're listening, but you're also developing your own point of view and what resonates with you and where you want to go with your career. And I think, all too often we look ahead and we look at what's next and where we want to be, rather than looking at the opportunity of what you're doing now. And the other thing that I would always believe is, the best thing that you can do to prepare for your next job is to excel at your current one.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah. I I love that kind of framing, Ted, about curiosity and being on a learning journey. I've always personally believed that is how we bring relevance to everyone is continuing to evolve and invest in, in our own personal development. But I also I fundamentally believe that. This expression of 70% of what we know today will be irrelevant in less than 24 months is a very compelling sort of message that we all have to take. That if we don't invest in that personal development, that curiosity, that listening to others. We won't be relevant. But I love the way that you have framed that and also the balance of some of the formal learning, because I too believe in that. But I also believe it's what we do every day in terms of investing in our growth and the journey that, that we're all on. So thank you Ted. You always bring such engaging thought leadership to all of us, and I know that you've shared insights that will inspire and guide many in our community and to our audience. I'd love to thank you for joining us. If you've enjoyed today's episode, we invite you to explore more stories@itspersonalstories.com, where you'll find interviews with leaders across the industry, just like Ed Ted, who are charting bold paths and building meaningful careers. So we hope to see you there, Ted. Thank you from the bottom of my heart for being with us today. I

Tedd Evers:

appreciate you very much. Thank you.