It's Personal Stories, A Hospitality Podcast

Lukasz Dabrowski_ SVP_ HRS interviewed by Dorothy Dowling _Edited_

• David Kong

Share episode

In this episode of 'It's Personal Stories,' Dorothy Dowling interviews Lukasz Dabrowski, Senior VP of Global Supplier Relations at HRS. Dabrowski shares insights on his extensive international career, leadership lessons, relationship building, and balancing professional and personal life through the Japanese concept of Ikigai.

Dorothy Dowling:

Greetings. I am Dorothy Dowling. Welcome to its Personal Stories, a hospitality podcast dedicated to highlighting the inspiring journeys of leaders in the hospitality industry. We are a nonprofit organization focused on empowering personal success. Today I am delighted to welcome Lucas Dabrowski, senior Vice President, global Supplier Relations at HRS Lucas. It's truly an honor to have you with us today.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Dorothy, thank you for having me. The honor is mine. I consider this interview one of the highlights and peaks of my career so far. So really appreciate the invite. Thank you.

Dorothy Dowling:

Wow, that's a wonderful compliment to all of us. Thank you. Our conversations are all about empowering personal success or the lived experience, lessons and wisdom of extraordinary leaders like yourself. So we are very much looking forward to your wisdom today.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

I I hope I live long enough to live up to half of those compliments though.

Dorothy Dowling:

Okay. You're too guide. All right. Maybe let's get right to it because your career is extraordinarily impressive. You have spanned continence companies and challenges throughout your career. I'm wondering if you can walk us through your career journey and how intentional the career mapping was that really shaped the opportunities that you choose, chose to pursue.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

I'll I'll try to wrap it up in the next four hours. So lemme start this. Okay. Only kidding. I I was attracted to step into the let's say professional world quite early in my life. Being a, an introvert teenager I decided I had to, break that barrier between me and other people in terms of communicating, public speaking, et cetera, et cetera. Decided to throw myself into the deep waters and and became a tour guide at the age of 17. Born and raised in Warsaw, Poland. This was my sort of initial realm and then extended into some European countries. I was active in, in the uk in Western Europe, in France as well. Some years into it, I I decided I I need to stay put for a little longer and I joined one of the leading global chains in 1997 that was married, international, went through all of the ranks and started really low made it into sales and marketing. And from then on expanded into multiple different countries. So went from Poland all the way through to uk, Greece France done multiple projects in Russia and the us. And yeah, got extremely attracted to exploring international territories and cultures. I was lucky to, continue that with my next employer. It's HRS celebrated my 15th anniversary quite recently. Congratulations. Thank you. And and the cool thing about it, none of those 15 years felt alike or the same. They were also full of excitement and international travel. Five years into the job, I I went into my first global role operating out of Germany, but. Literally living on an airplane. And since then, since 2014, late, I, I do circle the world anywhere from five up to 15 times each year. I I then moved from Germany to Japan which was my official Asia Pacific residence. Tokyo, but spent most of my time in China, Southeast Asia, India. Australia. So really covered the the entire region all the way up until Covid came out to to greet us on that side of the world a little earlier than in the west. I took that opportunity as a silver lining, relocated back to Europe, and I'm still performing my global supplier relations duties, but based out of south of Europe. Out of priest these days.

Dorothy Dowling:

I want, I'm wondering if we could explore a little bit more around just the leadership roles, and you have taken on some really complex assignments in terms of building the HRS brand and the relationships around the world. I'm wondering if you could help our audience understand what drew you to these opportunities and how taking on all of these really significant global roles really shaped you personally and professionally. I.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

So I, I've always been a curious person and I think that's, that really helps. Growing up in Socialist Poland leaves you hungry for experiencing, anything outside of the Iron Curtain. I was doing a lot of reading and the opportunity to travel was always a dream of mine. As simple as it is, that was my motivation. That was my, my main reason for pursuing international opportunities. And I have to say it's also about, very quickly into it, realizing that with travel comes a very unique type of learning that is based on cultural experiences, that is based on different observations. In terms of how markets stick, how different businesses operate in those markets, and I found that absolutely fascinating. And one of those, I think underlying common denominators was always yes, getting through the intercultural bit. So really understanding the the way that locals think and, and the way they engage in business. That's that's definitely something that impacted my my business acumen a lot. I even call it international imagination. I consider it one of the pretty significant qualities in business these days. Yeah, that's that's probably the main reason.

Dorothy Dowling:

If I may, Lucas, you have some of the rules and just the responsibilities that you took on, particularly driving growth in China and you were really blazing new trails. I'm just wondering if you can talk a little bit more about some of those cultural learnings.'cause I agree with you, when you travel the world, I think you get a very different perspective. But when you have to develop business in a brand new territory for a company, with the kind of leadership role you had and you had to staff and build the partner relations and really figure out the go-to market strategies in many different territories around the world. I'm just wondering if there's any wisdom from all of those experiences that you could share with our audience.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Yeah. I would say that the number one would always be stay humble, keep your eyes and ears open, and really try to invest in understanding I. Your surroundings, both in terms of culture and the business. Never assume anything about that. Whatever great business model you might be operating that works fantastically well in, I don't know, Western Europe or in North America, will instantly be successful in the other areas of the world in Latin America, Asia Pacific, in Africa. That is something that that should never be assumed. And you you actually have to with the value proposition that you operate with, you have to act as a I like the comparison of a key maker, right? So you have the same materials that these are the element of the value proposition that you carry. But but you have to cut the key to fit the lock to a particular market. It is the same elements of the value proposition, but they might be played and orchestrated in a different fashion to achieve success in a new territory. And that's based on a huge set of circumstances. A handshake in north America doesn't equal a handshake and the smile in Japan or in China. So yeah, just when you think you might be getting ahead, next morning might bring a slight disappointment. Yeah, and I think that's all beautiful. That's that's just part of of the diversity of of our planet.

Dorothy Dowling:

I really love the way that you've thought about it as being a key and unlocking the value proposition in a different way and being able to nuance how that door might open. And I also really love the message about being humble. I. Lucas.'cause I do think that is a really important thing when you go into another country is to not to assume that the way that you think is the way that others may think and the way you might attack a problem is the way that they may approach problem solving. I, I'm wondering if we could talk a little bit more about that because given some of the territories that you've had to really unlock some of that value proposition and really think about problem solving in some of those territories. Is there an approach that you used in terms of breaking down some of those complex challenges and figuring out how to solve the problem in those different territories around the world?

Lukasz Dabrowski:

So I definitely, yes I was growing up as a big fan of Stephen Covey, at the Seven Habits. So Seek First who understands them to be understood would be the number one rule to apply. And and there's really nothing wrong with, staying silent and just listening and observing in the first meetings that you go to and establishing yourself in a new territory, in a new market. It's actually a, not just a sign of that you are open to take in this, new knowledge and experience, but it's also a major sign of respect that I think especially when it comes to the cultures outside of the Western Hemisphere, makes a huge difference. So that would be number one. Then I would always question any problem that's that I encounter. And also the opportunities that I encounter with the five why's. So it really is about getting to the bottom of the root cause of what is the issue, what is the challenge, what is the problem? But also, why do we see certain things as opportunities? Why do we see these concrete elements as as successful, as valuable elements of the proposition that we bring to the table. And. It's not about assuming and simple taking it for granted, this is where most people think that they've won. No. It's also about understanding exactly why, what is that thing that triggers a buying decision for instance. So over time, I think the the one reflection that grew on me and one of the elements of problem solving that that I, incorporated in my in my methodology is is data. So yeah, I I would not make a single call without having all the data that is relevant to making a decision in front of me that came with experience and age

Dorothy Dowling:

and some of the technology that has empowered some of that information to us in different ways as well. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I'm wondering if we could talk a little bit about some of the people that have, influenced your career, the mentors, the champions, allies that have helped you grow and helped shape your leadership. I'm wondering if there's lessons learned that you would offer to the audience.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Most definitely. I have to say, I looking back, I know I was blessed. I was truly lucky. I. To to come across inspirational leaders mentors allies and partners, that, that helped me grow, that believed in me, that respected me. And and yeah, for whatever reason have chosen to to stay by my side. It is extremely important to extremely important to cherish those, those relationships as they are the additional evidence or validation that every human being needs in terms of proving their worth, that they're heading in the right direction. The only additional thing that I have to say that I have to add is Arthur Schopenhauer being my favorite philosopher. That I grew up reading lot of an Austrian gentleman was one of his papers he wrote was about that the majority of our learnings in life, the majority of what we know is based on negative versus positive. Most of us, we we like to quickly forget about those negative examples that we see as in, oh, I'll never be that person, or I will never act like that while down the road. And now looking back I can definitely say that it is true. Yes, there is definitely more of those examples and they're extremely valuable when you actually acknowledge their. Value properly. So yeah, most of our learnings come from what we would normally consider mistakes or failures or hardships. All of that is far more common than success and happiness and yeah they're to be valued equally in my opinion.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yeah, I think for sure it is that growth mindset that you're referencing Lucas in terms of approaching failures or things that didn't quite work out the way we would've hoped as I. Really learning from those and being able to go back and do that forensic kind of assessment of what we might have done differently and how that might have changed outcomes. But I really do appreciate how humble you are and the way you think about that leadership journey. And I also have great respect when you talk about how people identified something in you that maybe you didn't necessarily see yourself. But I do think you've had an incredible career and you've taken on. Extraordinary challenges. So I think there are many that look up to you in terms of just the kind of ways that you have embraced really difficult assignments and have taken them on and have been so successful in executing on all of those things. I, I'm wondering if we can talk even more about that because when I look at the. Way the business travel space in particular is undergoing and what I consider maybe the largest sea change I have seen in my career. Particularly with AI and modern modernization of business travel re retailing. I would love for you to share with the audience how you really stay on top of all of, the change management and your learning and your ability to add so much value to your global partners.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Dorothy, first and foremost, thank you very much for all the kind words and compliments of course, from you. It's means a lot to me, trust me. I think, we go back many years, thank you for that. Yes. I think the again, back to Stephen Covey's example, sharpening the saw. The last of the seven habits is something that comes to mind in terms of investment in personal growth. And I think a lot of us tend to perceive personal growth as as a certain process that is very defined and locked in and maybe even planned or orchestrate inside our Outlook calendars. But but it to me it happens on a daily basis and. Quite often, very seamlessly. My perspective is the following. I'm very lucky to be surrounded by pure innovation on a daily basis. The business that I that I work for the colleagues that I work with are industries, innovators, entrepreneurs, and disruptors. And and that goes back to the point of the five whys. And that goes back to, identifying opportunities and pain points and addressing them with a lot of effort and conviction. In that process, there is no such thing as a failure to be honest. There is either a win or a learning to be applied, and I very much respect company cultures that have that built into them. So allowing. For people of any rank in the company to actually try and and if a mistake is made and then that mistake is considered a valuable learning. That's that learning element is that learning aspect is also something that is tremendously important to me. I I feel accomplished at the end of the day when I have learned something new, even if it's a minor detail, I. But something that I didn't know yesterday that drives me. I I would probably die of boredom in any other environment that is maybe more like a Swiss watch in terms of predictability of operations. And and again, last but not least, to the point of sharpening the, so I think it's it's extremely important to to connect the the effort. That we invest into growing personally with making sure that we also have the time to to unwind, yeah, to regain energy, to recharge, to go back to our power bank, whatever that might be. I I definitely appreciate that part a lot. Being where I am.

Dorothy Dowling:

I think you've offered some really important elements there because I do think immersing yourself with colleagues and that they may be within your company and certainly within the industry, that really we all mentor each other and I think we all offer lots of opportunities to grow together. And I think sometimes just the work you have done through the industry engagement that you have committed to has really powered. A lot of that learning for you Lucas and as, as well as for HRS. So I always commend how active you are in the industry. I think the other thing that the message that you just talked about is just that organic nature. And I, I fundamentally believe for people that are in that sort of marketing, distribution, sales, that you have to stay engaged because that is, a lot of it just happens in the day to day in terms of. The opportunities that present themselves in our activities. And I think the last message, which is something I have really come to respect as I've gotten older, is that recharging just refreshes your capabilities in terms of giving you some time to take in what you might have learned that you may not have. Fully digested, but also just empowers your capabilities because you need to be well rested to really, I think, optimize a lot of the opportunities that are before you. So I think those are really important messages to our audience, and I thank you for sharing those.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

You're welcome. Yes, indeed. I couldn't agree more. It's a major effort to tackle even the basic understanding of our very complex ecosystem. And, it takes a lot. I think it takes a lot of effort to get through it, to understand it, to trace, the flow of values and and also understanding of the business models traditional and new innovative ones. Follow the money flows really understand it from the inside out. That is far more demanding than it used to be. Some years ago, I.

Dorothy Dowling:

I, I love that element. That's something I've always tried to keep in mind is to follow the money flow because I think that really does tie back to the value proposition, making sure you're delivering. On all the different individuals that are looking to you to help them in terms of their business outcomes. That's a really important message. I wonder if we can talk a little bit about you personally Lucas.'cause I have always loved watching you on stage. You bring so much energy, passion, you're really exceptional. And I would love to hear in terms of you, you are often put into high stakes situations where you have to perform. I'm wondering if there's any wisdom that you could share with our audience about how do you prepare and deliver in terms of, not only the content, but just the authe authenticity of your messaging.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Thank you again. Do I I try my best. I,

Dorothy Dowling:

you do an exceptional job you are one of the best

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Long way to go, long way to go to match some of the best industry speakers, including yourself. It's it's nothing too complex, but I think it in terms of my personal view and style and recommendation at the same time it's about a few basic items. If you fail to prepare to fail. Yes the research behind the topic that I'm speaking on is multidimensional and it's something that needs to be done very thoroughly. I'd rather not speak on a topic that I am not confident enough about. And obviously. Doing that research. It's also about, rehearsing the main points that you want to get across. So that's preparation. Second would be making sure that next to owning your area of expertise, you you also know your audience, that you recognize who's out there, why did they come, what is it that they're looking for what different interests they represent. What is of interest to them? What is, what makes them curious? Why is it that they sacrifice their time and dedicate their time to to sit in the audience and watch someone speak or or follow a panel? It it is equally important also in, in the case of any co-panelists and presenters making sure that again we understand what is there. Point of view shaped by where is it that they originate from, what business they represent, what are the key objectives that they want to attain through participation. And and with all that preparation I think, yeah I would feel confident enough to appear on stage. And that is, I would say, half of the success. The other half is interactive, the other half is just about reading the audience. You will have convinced, very well, you'll have various different types of audience. Very passive, half asleep, old, young, multicultural, you name it. And just looking straight into their eyes and and confirming, assuring that they actually follow and that they agree or disagree is is actually a phenomenal opportunity.'cause you can make twists and turns in your presentation to bond with the audience better to reach them in a far more personal way than originally intended. Or to leave them with a few simple messages to go away with if if they're really not that active. That's also about making sure, yes the key highlights or the key points that you wanna get across are explicit,

Dorothy Dowling:

are,

Lukasz Dabrowski:

well heard.

Dorothy Dowling:

I think, that is very strategic in terms of what you're talking about, because I do fundamentally believe that. Prepping in terms of content is really important. Then you had also talked about understanding the audience because again, we are often put into situations. Where it is a very different audience, particularly when we're traveling. And then that third element about who you're engaging with on stage to make sure you know them and can obviously work together with those individuals. But I do think that is the magic that you bring Lucas in terms of the way you engage with the audience. So that element of reading the audience and then. Trying to reach them because that's what I have seen you do on stage in terms of actively outreaching to the audience and trying to drive that level of interest. So I think that's really good advice. And then I also really love that summation that you're offering at the end to just crystallize the takeaways that the audience may want to learn from you to make sure they walk away with really that understanding of what the conversation really was about. So thank you for really dissecting your approach in such a significant way for us. My

Lukasz Dabrowski:

pleasure. If I, again, I don't consider myself an exceptional speaker, but if I can do what I can do on a basic level as a former introvert, teenager, drowning in books not leaving his room then I'm pretty sure anybody watching can do better.

Dorothy Dowling:

I'm not sure about that Lucas, but I do think it's the intentionality and I do think that introverts can flex. I am also an introvert. And you have to flex in those situations. But I do think it is really the preparation and really putting your game face on when you get into those environments.'cause you have to bring it to the audience too. Respect them and also engage with them. So thank you. I'm wondering if I could explore a little bit more on some of this engagement capability that you bring to the table, because you have generated an enormous amount of trust with the partners you're extraordinarily well liked in the business. And I know that has been built over your career in terms of how you really built and nurtured. And protected a lot of those relationships over time. But I'm wondering if, again, there are thoughts that you could offer to the audience about how you have really developed that approach to relationship engagement and really continue to build upon that over your career.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Wow. So I think, yes we're touching on one of the sort of most complex and and sensitive points in terms of, stakeholder management. Stakeholder orchestration is is it's probably one of the most sophisticated and complex areas of the business. It's about understanding the business model on both ends. It is also understanding what is driving each one of the stakeholders. If we apply the classic MedTech model who's our. Economic buyer who's our champion, who's our influencer, supporter, et cetera, et cetera. It's it's important to realize what are they driven by in terms of perhaps KPIs or incentives. And last but not least, probably in the reverse order even, it's to understand them and reach them as people. I would say in most cases, even when we're successful we often look back and say, okay, I managed to tick two boxes out of three. But it is not always granted to us to win in all of those areas. I, I think it's, it really starts again with with approaching every single one of those interactions with with a lot of respect, with plenty of empathy and, again, international imagination helps. If we're talking about anything that happens on a global level it is about seeing the people behind the business, but it's also about understanding the business thoroughly. As far as what is the, what is considered to be the win for the other side, what is considered to be the walkaway points and, and then what is the pain point or an opportunity that's we are trying to address in this relationship? I I think this is also the time when data, comes back and is a true reinforcement of our efforts a very solid foundation of our preparation and then execution. Without it, I think none of those, intuitive ways would really work well enough in nowadays world. So yeah, I I also believe that the the sort of the area that we operate in, the area of innovation is always associated with risks. If we try our best, but, but we under deliver for whatever reason, or we even fail, it's it's actually a good thing to instead of trying sugarcoat it or or paint it green, just admit it. That builds trust. That builds mutual understanding and and bonds people.

Dorothy Dowling:

And again, a lot of very deep content that you shared with the audience, and I would like to just reinforce a few messages that you offered Lucas, because that element of preparation in terms of understanding who's in the room and what the role in the room, and just putting some science behind that relationship. Mapping in terms of preparation. I also do think about understanding what's driving everyone on the KPIs or the economic kind of value creation that. Is expected tho. Those are all really important elements to really prepare. And I also think that human element that you brought in terms of understanding the human being behind the role and trying to connect with them in a personal way, in a meaningful personal way is. Extraordinarily good advice and to me it really reflects how you have been so successful because you always bring the subject matter expertise. I think you are very good at reading audiences and understanding individual roles and players in the room, but I also think you have this ability to connect with individuals as humans, which, I think is what brings the magic, because I think when people like you I think they wanna invest. And I think further when you say, when you have a point of failure, when you've got a strong basis of likability, people accept that not everything is perfect, but that's what relationships are about. It's like you said with Stephen Covey, it's the deposit you put in the relationship bank account and sometimes you make a few withdrawals, but hopefully. The commitment to solve problems together is what triumphs in the end. So I really appreciate you talking about, again, the preparation, because one of the things over my career that I. I have sometimes been disappointed is that a lot of people think relationships are just a given and they don't recognize the effort. And actually the preparation to really offer value to partners. And again, I think that's been the hallmark of your career, that you have really shown others what you bring to the table, and that's why you have so many meaningful professional relationships in this industry, Lucas. So thank you.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Thank you, Dorothy. It's every new day is another opportunity in that dimension. So it's yeah, nobody's ever getting to anywhere near perfection in that sense. But yeah we all try. I.

Dorothy Dowling:

Yes, for sure. It's a, it is a journey for sure. I wonder if we could talk a little bit about your team, because you have a team around the world. We're now in some markets working in hybrid kinds of work environments. I wonder if you can offer any thoughts in terms of how you really stay connected with all of your teammates around the world and how you really bridge alignment across some of the geographical distances.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

So yes, I think we've entered an entire new era of remote work and say, from the time when it started, which was still the early days of Covid. It was seamlessly easier. We didn't know it at the time because everybody we connected with at that point were still familiar faces. They were just on the screen instead of in front of you.

Dorothy Dowling:

Of course. Yeah.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

And that changed some years into it. And, plenty of of newcomers stepped on boards new experts, valuable talents, who nonetheless needs education, who needs mentoring, coaching, guiding and who need to find themselves in in a new professional environment with enough self-discipline to to retain themselves in a in a remote based position. This is where I think a lot of how to best phrase it. A lot of attention from not just my side, but from many leaders went towards the the frameworks, in which we operate. Not so much the just the direct interactions, but, trying to, paint something that we are imagining as a well-working remote environment. And there was two sets of inspirations that I remember very clearly. One is a an excellent author, a selling author, and a friend of mine Kian Gohar, who wrote a fantastic book on collaborating. As teams in remote working environments came out at the best time. Also, it was just towards the end of the pandemic and contained multiple valuable learnings. The other is is is a book written by one of the former Amazon senior leaders. I had the pleasure of meeting him personally. His name is Bill Carr. And, that chapter of the book called Working Backwards describes a set of management tools that are designed to govern a, an organization that may be spread all around the world and with multiple people operating out of office spaces, as well as all kinds of remote locations. And essentially the framework is based on. Very detailed transparency on the mutual understanding of how the business operates and how do I, as an employee fit in. But it's far more complex and more detailed than, let's say, the system of OKRs objectives and key results, right? Drawing those trees of dependents and who do I need to succeed? This is based on utilizing a set of management tools that start with, narrative, which is a few page summary of the actual concepts, the vision in great detail, no slides, only texts, so that's anybody can ask questions and request clarifications. That then trickles down to a set of key strategic objectives based on the strategy described in the narrative. And and later on breaks down into and I think that is how we measure success. So really input output metrics et cetera. Giving everybody that sort of a framework is making it a lot easier for anybody to imagine what does success mean for the company, but also to very directly and very precisely say, how do I contribute to that success? It is focused on the collaborative spirit in terms of, okay, who do I need to get there? But also on the value of the individual in the overall success of the business that I found extremely useful. And my practice, it's until this day I don't think it will ever go away. Definitely that. Other than that my, my style as far as working with colleagues all around the world it really is based on full open communications and not too much micromanagement. I I I may be old school in that way, but I expect people to live up to their titles. And titles don't matter to me at all. Uhhuh, it's all about marriage. It's all about whether they really are the right fit and and whether they enjoy what they do. It's a very transparent, result oriented and collaboration oriented style.

Dorothy Dowling:

I appreciate you sharing those two books. I have not read either one, so I'm going to get I'm certainly going to invest the time in reading those'cause I do love the thesis of what you have presented here, Lucas. It's about the intentionality of communications and I. Certainly we have to have a much different approach in terms of how we really support individuals in terms of their understanding and really balancing out what that leadership communication needs to be. So I think that structure that you have offered, that's a lot to all of us. I think the other component is I've always believed that leaders define culture. So that element of. Accountability and expectations and people stepping up and stepping into the roles and delivering is an important message because I think we all own that in terms of our commitments to our employer and to each other. Good messages for all of us in terms of leadership. We're coming up to the end of our interview now, Lucas, but I would love to. Just get your perspective because you're a dad, you're a husband, you travel the world more than anyone I know. And you're a very hardworking executive. I'm wondering how you find harmony and support your family in terms of all of their needs as well as all the professional responsibilities that you carry.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

I I cannot say, I have always found harmony and the business versus private life priorities are quite often very difficult to manage simultaneously. I do remember a lot of sacrifices in major concessions in my past life, but I think what has helped me reach a point of stability. Beyond that, the point of happiness you are talking to a very happy man Dorothy. I know that it really starts with me being a huge fan of of a Japanese concept called Ikigai. Which consists of let's say a roadmap, of priorities to pursue in your life, both business and private. It splits into four simple four dimensions, but they overlap with each other. One is doing something that you love. Second is doing something that you're good at'cause they're not the same things they might be. Third is what is it that you can get paid for? And I'm not talking about a lot of money. It's just whether you can get paid for it. And the fourth is probably the most complex and difficult one. It's it's about what the world needs. And in the intersection of those four guidance elements live values like mission vocation, profession for us to consider altogether. And and I think, that has driven me to to understanding how important balancing those priorities are. I gotta say probably too late in, in life. But yes, realizing the the sources of my true energy, the benefits of my family time, the benefits of spending time in nature, which is something I absolutely love. Protecting my, what I call the inner core, which is in simple terms, leaving all the trouble outside the door of of your home. That might be work related. And and yeah, the only other thing that I can think of is, and I think that is about physical activity. And I think that is about my favorite sports that I try to make time for. Now, but yes, ikigai was the key. It still is.

Dorothy Dowling:

You have shared a lot of profound wisdom with us today, Lucas. So I am very grateful for how much time you've invested in preparing to share all your ideas with our audiences today. And again, I just thank you for all that you do for our industry. You're an inspiration to me. I love watching what you do and I love watching how you do it. So thank you for making time for this interview today.

Lukasz Dabrowski:

Thank you so much. I I'm delighted to be here and once again, many thanks for having me. Really appreciate it.

Dorothy Dowling:

Wonderful. I would like to again, thank Lucas and I'd also like to thank our audience, and if you've enjoyed this interview, I hope you'll visit us as it's personal stories.com, where you'll find webcasts and podcasts from other industry leaders like Lucas, which are designed to empower your knowledge and fuel your spirit. I hope to see you there.