Michael Evans, President, Marcus Hotels & Resorts, interviewed by Lan Elliott

Michael shares the factors that contributed to his success plus the importance of intellectual curiosity.  He talks about the value of getting involved in industry groups and how public speaking helps to build your personal brand.  Michael shares his 3 steps for leading teams – and while the concepts are simple, he admits executing them is harder.  Finally, he shares advice for having a long and successful career.

Transcript

Lan Elliott: 0:00

Hello and welcome to D E I Advisors. My name is Lan Elliot on behalf of D e I advisors, and today's guest advisor is Michael Evans, who is the president of Marcus Hotels and Resorts. Welcome Michael.

Michael Evans: 0:14

Thank you. Thanks for having me.

Lan Elliott: 0:16

Absolutely. For those of you who don't know Marcus Hotels, they are a publicly traded owner operator of hotels and they've actually been around for 87 years, which is something I didn't know about. So thank you for sharing that, Michael. Yeah. Michael, we've actually been friends for a while, so I happen to know, you have a really interesting career journey. Could you share with us some of the inflection points in your career and if there was a particular factor or something that you think contributed to your success?

Michael Evans: 0:49

Sure, sure. So, okay. So starting with the inflection points, I mean, I think, uh, there's been a number of them. Uh, most of them relate to sort of big career moves that I, that I. Um, you know, beginning with, um, when I left the practice of law, so, you know, I went to law school to, um, knowing I did not wanna be an attorney. Uh, but I, when I got out, I figured I should get some real world experience in that. And so I, I practiced law for three years. I was always interested in real estate and development generally, not specifically hotels at that time. And, um, and, and spent a lot of time looking and talking to people about different opportunities in, in real estate. And the opportunity came up, uh, to join Marietta up at their headquarters. They had, uh, just formed, and this is in the late nineties, had just formed a group to work on restructurings and things like that. And so, um, so I joined Marriott and that was, you know, the beginning of my, uh, career in hospitality. And then, um, you know, kind of the next inflection point I, I would say was when, so I was with Marriott. Um, I'd been at headquarters six years and had the opportunity to move overseas with Marri. Moved to Hong Kong, uh, to do development throughout Asia, and then eventually moved to, uh, London where I did development for Marriott in Europe and the Middle East. And, um, that international experience was, was a true turning point, I think, in my career. And, um, it's something that, that, you know, I think really helped me, um, advance my career. So, you know, those were two major inflection points. And then, you know, I, I eventually, I, I went to, um, I left Marion after 10. Went to Las Vegas, joined mgm and this is in, um, early 2008. And we were really focused on experiential hospitality. And that was before, um, uh, you know, it was a buzzword. It was before we had as the proliferation of lifestyle hotels and soft brands. And I really think of MGM as being one of the leaders in experiential hospitality and, and being able to be a part of that, um, you know, I think really, really helped me a lot and helped my. And then, you know, then the, the last inflection point would be when I joined a little more than three years ago, uh, Marcus Hotels and resorts and, and had the opportunity to, um, you know, pull together kind of everything that I'd learned throughout my career and, and the ability to, uh, to lead and, and um, uh, continue to develop this hotel and lead is some really amazing teams. So, yeah, those were kind of the main inflection points I would say throughout, throughout my. Um, I think you asked, sorry, go ahead. Yeah, did, so, um, I think you asked about, um, what contributed to my success. So, you know, a number of things. I mean, one, um, and I, I really think being passionate about whatever I've been doing, um, I think it's critical for anyone, whatever you're gonna do, you have to be passionate about it. We spend so much time, you know, in our careers and work that if that, if you're not passionate about it, um, you won't excel at it and you won't be great. So I think that that's number one. You know, I think also, um, being a strategic thinker, um, knowing how to analyze situations and develop and execute a sound plan, I think, I think that was really helpful. Um, I'd say, you know, another point, and I think my family would probably take issue with, with this, but, um, having a reasonable amount of emotional intelligence. Right. Really, you know, the, the ability to. Effectively manage people and to, and to work with people both inside and, uh, outside of the organization. And so, um, I think, I think that's been helpful. I'll, I'll tell you a quick story. So when I first joined Marriott, you, I was in my, in my kinda late twenties, um, relatively junior position. Then I was a manager, but I was working on some pretty big projects and I, um, I had to influence a lot of people that were much more senior than me. And, and I think the ability to do that effectively, um, really led to, um, you know, a fair amount of success that I had at Marriott, which of course then, then led on to, to other opportunities within, within my career. So I say those things combined with a really strong work ethic are kind of the, some of the keys. Uh, to, to my success.

Lan Elliott: 4:58

Really great points and things that people don't always talk about, right? They talk about getting skills, but they don't really talk about the eq, they don't talk about being able to influence people around in the organization and might not be people that report to you. You really still have to have influence across the organization, and that's a skill that's really important to develop. So I love that you shared. So, Michael, you don't get to where you are without overcoming a few obstacles. Can you share a little bit about how you process obstacles? Like what do you look for first? What do you do first when you come across something like that?

Michael Evans: 5:36

Well, first of all, I think it's really critical when you're facing obstacles and challenges to, to stay common level-headed, right? Um, I have this saying that, you know, we can only do what we can do. We can only control what we can control. I must have said that a million times to the team, you know, throughout the pandemic and certainly the early days of the pandemic, right? And so, yeah. Um, getting excited. It doesn't help. We don't, we don't do our best thinking, um, when, when we're excited. So staying calm I think is really critical, uh, to start with. And then I think really thinking about, you know, what's, what's the root cause of, of the challenge that we're facing, the issues. Um, I have another expression, which is sort of the bottom line is, right. I like just zeroing in and getting to what's, what's the bottom line of something and understanding what's causing a challenge. Uh, you know, from there, um, put together, you develop a plan, right? And so, Um, you understand what the issue is, you put a plan together and then, then I think it's just a matter of working to execute on that while at the same time being kind of mindful that, you know, your plan may not address the challenge, you may have to pivot and, and to have sort of a, a plan B, so to speak. Right. But, um, that's sort of how I would say that I, I process, um, you know, challenges that I'm facing.

Lan Elliott: 6:49

Any, any advice on motivating your team when they're tackling a challenge?

Michael Evans: 6:55

Well, I think, I mean, well one is, and it's not easy to do, but to get people to focus on staying calm, right? Not everyone's nature to, to do that. So starting there as I said, but then, um, really ensuring, um, and getting people to work together as a team, right? And knowing that we're gonna work in a collaborative manner and that, um, ensuring that everyone sort of, it feels like we're like, you know, we're part of the team and that we have each other's. And, and, um, when, when there's a challenging situation, working in that type of environment, um, I find always proves to be much more, uh, successful.

Lan Elliott: 7:30

That's great. Thank you. Moving on to a related topic, but it's around taking risks and you've taken a number of risks throughout your career and you, you've mentioned a few of them, but could you share an example of where you've successfully taken a risk and, and how, how you mentally prepare yourself to take a chance on.

Michael Evans: 7:54

Yeah. Well, I, I, first of all, I think as, as you know, I'm, I'm a little bit predisposed to risk ta taking probably more than, than, than a lot of people, right? I mean, I, I spent a good part of my twenties jumping off airplanes for fun, and I love deepwater scuba diving. And, and as you know, motorcycling has, uh, has been my lifelong passion and hobby. So I'm, yes, I, I

Lan Elliott: 8:14

remember you telling me that sports are no fun if you can't potentially die doing them. So did I

8:18

say

Michael Evans: 8:19

that? Oh, I, I may have, but, um, no, but. Uh, but, you know, but seriously, I, I, I really approach, um, calculated risks in business. It's kind of the same way that I, um, approach those related to my hobbies, right? And that is to start off by educating myself. You, uh, you don't just jump out of a plane or go scuba diving or, or jump on a motorcycle without proper training. And the same thing really applies when it comes to business. Right. You have to educate yourself and you have to research the issue and, and, um, get as much information as you possibly can. Um, about, about the issue at hand, you know, and that includes, um, you know, evaluating all the risks and the rewards, um, considering, um, you know, worst case scenario. And, um, and then evaluating all that and, and, and coming up and making an informed decision. And, and I think, I think that's really critical. And then, and then again, at a similar to what I said earlier, having a contingency plan, right? If things don't go as planned, um, when you take this risk, you know, have a plan B and knowing, you know, how, how to pivot and being, you know, uh, prepared to do so. So,

Lan Elliott: 9:32

Yeah, things don't always go the way that you think, so sometimes you can come up with the best plan and then the world turns left like it did a few years ago, and, uh, and you have to adapt,

Michael Evans: 9:40

right? Absolutely. It that happened, you know, I joined, I joined Marcus in January of 20 and, uh, so I, I literally finished touring our last, um, hotel on March 10th of 20, and then three days later, the world shut down. So big pivot for sure.

Lan Elliott: 9:56

Well, you got in all the hotel tours at the right moment so that you could lead the company from from Milwaukee.

Michael Evans: 10:02

I did. I did. Yeah.

Lan Elliott: 10:05

I wanted to talk a little bit about developing a network, because that's something that people aren't always comfortable digging into because it's not something that maybe their personality doesn't lend themselves to it. Walking into a cocktail party where you don't know anybody seems really scary, but hospitality is really, A business that is very relationship based. Um, we actually met negotiating across the table from one another is how we first met, and we ended up becoming great friends. And can you share a little bit about how you've built your network and maybe how do you network in a way that suits your personality?

Michael Evans: 10:44

Sure. Yeah. So I'm gonna start by saying, I mean the, the major foundation for my network was honestly built back in, um, my early days at. Right. Some of my closest relationships, including, you know, you and your husband Mike, are from, from those early days. Right. I mean, I think there was something about all of us, even though you and I worked for different, two different companies, we worked pretty closely together in deals. Um, there's something about being in the trenches together, I think while we're building our careers, that that made people a lot closer. Uh, you know, when I look back, it's, gosh, it's, you know, I think it's over 25 years now, around 25 years that, um, Since those relationships were established and, and honestly, those relationships that I established back in those days really remained some of my, um, most trusted and valued connections and, and relationships. So, um, I think that's really important. And, and it's, and I don't wanna get on too much of a soapbox here, but it's, it's actually leads to kind of one of my concerns that I. About work today and the, the desire for many people, uh, to that wanna work remotely. Mm-hmm. And, you know, I think there's a lot of discussion about negative impact on culture and impact on collaboration around that. But I also think one of the impacts of remote work and what that can have is on long people's long-term relationships because you just can't build that same level of relationship with people. If, if, if you're not. And, and so, um, you know, when I look back on, on, you know, the relationships that I've built, as I said, they were built sort of in the trenches together. And, and I think it's important to, to do that. I'll get off my soapbox now about that issue. But, um, you know, so, so you asked about how, um, how do I network and, and kind of what suits my personality, right? So I, um, You know, I, I love meeting new people. I do, I truly do. But at the same time, I have really a, I'd say a relatively low tolerance for kind of repetitive BS conversations, right? I mean, we've, we've all, we've all been to, uh, industry conferences where by the end of the two or three days, uh, you know, we feel like we've, we've, it's gone through Groundhog Day, right? And, and had the same conversations over and over. Um, I don't think anybody enjoys, enjoys that, and, For me, when I am meeting new people, I always try to find, um, some level of personal connection to the person, right? I mean, that could be a common place that we worked. Fortunately, you know, there are thousands and thousands of married alumnis. Um, it could be a common friend, it could be a place where we've lived or traveled. Or even better a shared hobby or passion, right? So try and find some sort of personal connection, uh, to the person. I think that that makes a difference. It makes you, makes them stand out to you and, and makes you more memorable to them as well. Um, so I think that's important. And then, you know, kind of two other points around networking that, that would, that I would make. You know, one, um, it's, I think it's really important to get involved and be active in all the various industry groups, um, and organizations. Obviously there's big ones like A H L A, which leads our industry, but there's a lot of other subgroups and smaller groups that are focused on particular segments of the business. Um, many, many of the larger companies have, uh, internal groups that people can join. So I think that's really, really critical. It's a great way to meet people and it's a great way to. You know, build up your, your reputation. And then, um, and the second would be speaking engagements, right? And I think try and try and do what you can to secure speaking engagements and, and, um, so people, you know, hear your name. And over time you do enough of those and, and you, you become more of a known, known quantity in the industry, right? So, um, so those are kind of the two things I'd say.

Lan Elliott: 14:35

That's such great advice because I think a lot of people will shy away from public speaking and it is such an important component of building your personal brand and getting exposure out there. Um, so I think it's worthwhile and it does take, it does take time and practice and, but the more you do it, the more comfortable you get with it. So I, I love that you mentioned that. Yeah. Switching gears over to mentors and champions, cuz I know you've had a few in your, in your amazing career. How have your mentors or your champions helped advance your career?

Michael Evans: 15:11

So, it's interesting. You know, I, I don't know that I have any real formal mentors. There's a lot of people that I actually learned a lot from, right? I mean, beginning with kinda the attorneys that I worked for, right outta law school, I learned a tremendous amount from them. I learned. Um, and how to be an effective communicator, both, you know, orally and in writing, which is really important. Um, I learned, you know, early on in my career at Marriott, right? I, uh, had had the opportunity to learn a lot from the late Jim Sullivan, right? I mean, anyone that was, uh, either worked in development and did deals at Marriott or, uh, You know, was what's, you know, developer of hotels during that time? Kind of from the, what Jim was there, I think mid eighties to, I think he retired in oh eight or oh nine. Right. And, and, uh, Jim was so focused on thinking about deals from, from every single angle, right? You, uh, you had to really strategize and think about, um, every aspect of deal, um, how best to position something, how best to negoti. And, and lots of different alternatives. And, and so thinking about deals holistically, I've really learned a lot from Jim. Now, Jim, um, Jim had a heart of gold that he tried to hide, I think behind his, like, gruff exterior. And so it was a lot of self-preservation, right? Learning from him. Um, and so, um, while, while he wasn't an official mentor of mine, I learned a tremendous, tremendous amount from him, um, as I know so many people in the industry did as well. Um, I'd also say, you know, cuz you used the word champions. I, I, I, um, I did have a number of champions that, that really played a major role in, in advancing my career. Um, one of those champions is someone that, that both you and I have worked for. So Joel Eisman, right? I worked for Joel early on in my days at Marriott. Um, you worked for him more recently at I H G. But Joel had, um, come back from Asia. He was, he was, uh, the first person to head of development in Asia for Marriott. And he was there, I'm not sure exactly how long. I think it was over a decade, I believe. And when he came back to, uh, Bethesda, he, um, headed up the global asset management team, which I was part of. So I worked for Joel and he was a big supporter of mine and, and was really instrumental in helping, um, make happen. Uh, moved to to Hong Kong initially. And um, as I mentioned earlier, that was a major inflection point in my career. And so, um, certainly Joel was, was one of the bigger champions that had a big effect on my career. And there's been others along the way, people that have seen some level of promise in me and have provided me with opportunities to, uh, to advance my career.

Lan Elliott: 17:52

That's great. So let me ask you this. How important do you. Is it to find mentors and champions, even if they're not formal mentors or what have you, how important is that and how, how can people go about it? Because we've heard there's a right way and there's a wrong way to do it. Mm-hmm.

Michael Evans: 18:08

Yeah. Well, I do think it's very important. Um, we need to have people that believe in us and help, help advance our careers. Right? Um, I also believe that that leaders today naturally want to help more junior people, right? You want to, you wanna help people that show promise and show commitment, and so, I really think that, you know, the, the best way to find champions and mentors is to start by, you know, demonstrate this, demonstrate your passion. Demonstrate your, you know, your hard work, your commitment, and, and quite frankly, some level of promise that, that, that you can one day be a strong leader. I think, um, if you do that, people will wanna help, will wanna help you. Um, So that, that, I mean, I think that's sort of table stakes, right? I then think you, you can be proactive about it as well. And I, and I honestly wasn't, uh, very good about this in my career. But looking back on it, um, I realized I probably should have been more proactive about actually asking people for, for help and mentorship and, and I, and I think it's good for people to do that. I do think you have to be, um, I'll say, you know, specific about what it is that you're looking for in, from the mentorship and from the relationship. Um, I think you need to be really open about, you know, the feedback that you're going to get. But, but I, if, if you can identify someone that, um, that you really want to learn from, I think that. You know, approaching them and asking them for, um, some guidance or mentorship, um, you know, is certainly something that you should do. And I think you'll find that, that most leaders will be more than happy to, uh, to do, to, you know, provide mentorship.

Lan Elliott: 19:43

Yeah, I think that's true. I think it's one of the wonderful things about our, our industry is that people naturally wanna help one another. So doing a great job is a, is a good way to do that. Right. Start that convers. One of the things I wanted talk about was leadership style, because in, in looking at our industry, we don't have as many women leaders as at the top as we have women employees at the bottom of our industry. If you think of it as a pyramid, and women leaders tend to have a different style than men is what I've noticed, but what characteristics or leadership style do you look for in your leaders?

Michael Evans: 20:21

Um, well, look, I, I think it's really important for, for leaders to be sort of action oriented and, you know, results driven, right? I mean, and so, um, you know, in the, in you've heard in the past and people talking about being, you know, people need to be aggressive or assertive and, and. I kind of, sometimes, sometimes I can, can be equated to sort of acting like a jerk, right? Which I'm gonna use a nice, nice language here since we're being videoed. But, um, and I don't think that's, that's the right approach, right? I mean, I think it's, um, I think leading by fear and, uh, is a really outdated concept, and I think it's much more effective to take sort of a, um, an affiliative leadership approach, right? Whereby, you know, you're building trust within the group and create emotional bonds and promote a sense of belonging within the organization. I think that's how you, you, you really lead and. You know, I'll, I'll tell you, the approach I take is sort of, I've always thought of it as three simple steps, or maybe simple to say, a little harder to execute. But I think of, I think of leadership sort of this way, right? I, you start off by, uh, building a team of not only talented people, but passionate people. Um, that's one. You know, two, you know, you know, create an environment that encourages collaboration and open communication among the. And then, and then third, um, empowering people to do their jobs, right? So you empower them while holding them accountable, uh, to clearly establish goals and milestones. So that's, that's really what I find to be the most effective formula leadership. Um, not, you know, an aggressive. Uh, in your face, you know, again, acting like a jerk type approach.

Lan Elliott: 22:09

Yeah. That pound on the table approaches really, I think that it's time has passed, so it has for sure. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I love that. Thank you. Thank you for the three points. Switching over to leading diverse teams. As you mentioned, you've lived in a lot of places in Hong Kong, in Europe, uh, but also working in, in throughout Europe and the Middle East when you were there, and then going over to gaming, which is kind of a different environment than the hospitality world that we had been in. So, Thinking about diversity can be so much more than race and gender. It can be diversity of thought or of different cultures or backgrounds. Given your work experience working around the world, you know, managing diverse teams can actually be more challenging than working with a homogeneous team that all think the same way and, and have the same background. What's, what's been your experience working with people from diverse cultures and different, different ways of thinking and how do you manage that?

Michael Evans: 23:09

Well, I, first of all lemme say that, you know, working with people from diverse cultures, it really has been one of the highlights of my career. Um, you know, you know, without a doubt, learning to work and partner with people from various cultures made me a, a much more effective leader. Again, that, that really started when, you know, when I moved, moved to Hong Kong, um, you know, there's. There's a real, um, difference in the way people do business around the world, right? In the US we tend to start, we work on deals, we get stuff done, and then through that process, sometimes you build a friendship or relationship with the people in, in Asia, in the Middle East, right? It's the exact opposite. So you, you don't get a deal done with somebody in Asia or the, or the Middle East, unless you've built a relationship with them first, and there's a level of trust. Um, so, you know, real, really very different approach to, to how we do things. In the West, right? Um, even, and then, and then even, you know, within Asia for example, and within certain markets there's, there's differences. How, how you do business in Japan is very different from how you do business in, in, uh, in China versus how you do business in Vietnam or, or any of the other countries, right? So, um, so you, you really have to be very focused on, on the cultural differences and then, Something that I learned by doing business over there and, and working with teams, right? I went over there and, and my, my colleagues were, were almost all from different cultures. And, um, you learn how important it's to really to, to stop and listen, um, you know, try and read people's body language and, and really try and, um, understand and appreciate the diverse perspectives that they bring from their culture. And, um, Doing that is, I think, really critical to having success in, in leading a diverse team, right? Understanding people, kind of where, where they're coming from and their perspective, and not just, not just through, you know, your lens.

Lan Elliott: 25:03

Um, yeah, that's that's so true, and especially now as. Inclusive cultures have become much more part of the common conversation and you're meeting people where they are. I think this idea just to dive in and just start going into the business side, which is what we've done mostly in the, in the us, that approach is not gonna work. It doesn't work in every culture, as you mentioned, but it also. Maybe doesn't work with every person, even here in the United States. So I love the idea of stopping and taking the time to get to know people that you're gonna be working closely

Michael Evans: 25:36

with. Yeah, absolutely.

Lan Elliott: 25:39

Yeah. One of our favorite questions at DEI, d e i advisors is what advice would you give to your younger. And I think it, it does lead to a bit of self-reflection to think about where you are now versus where you were then. So yeah. Michael, what, what advice would you give to your younger self?

Michael Evans: 25:58

So, it's interesting. I actually, I actually had a chance to think about this type of question about a year and a half ago. So when my oldest son, Gavin, was heading off to college for his freshman year. Um, at that time I wrote him a very long letter with kind of all my thoughts about life and the things I wish I knew when I went off to college. So, um, so I gave it, I gave this actually a lot of thought then, um, you know, there were a lot of personal things in, in that, in that letter, but some of the key themes and things that I touched on, um, you know, one was the importance of intellectual curiosity. And, you know, the importance of learning things, not just because you have to for a test or for your diploma or a work requirement, but simply better yourself, right? And become more knowledgeable and be more educated. So I think that's, that's something that's, that's really important that I, I wish I knew, um, and folks on a little bit more back in my, you know, freshman year in college.

Lan Elliott: 26:53

I think you were busy then.

Michael Evans: 26:56

I was. Um, you know, second I think is, is importance of balance in your life. I mean, I, and I've, I've always, I've always, uh, found that balance, you know, to be really important. And I knew this back then, but, um, I think I had a, a difficult time perhaps finding that right balance. Right. And, and particularly early on in my career, I was, I was so driven and, um, I'm not sure that I, that I had. The right level of balance between my professional career and, and personal life. Although, you know, I still found time to do things with my family and share a lot of common interests and, you know, we have a great relationship with, with, uh, my wife and kids. I wish in those early years of their life I had a little bit more balance. Um, so that's one. And then, you know, last thing I'll, I'll touch on is just the importance of patie. Um, patience, patient

Lan Elliott: 27:49

patience. I mean, Michael, most of your hobbies, racing motorcycles has nothing to do with patience. Right. You're, you're

Michael Evans: 27:55

right. And so, and, and, and that this is something that I wish, I wish I, I knew back then is that patience. And I'm, and I'm really thinking about from the standpoint of kind of, um, career choices, right? And, and there were, there were definitely times where I made decisions around my career because, um, I wasn't as patient as perhaps I should have been. And, you know, look, I'm. Very happy with the way my career has turned out, and I, I never look backwards, but, um, but I, that being said, I have thought about, you know, when I made certain de decisions to make moves, um, some of that was driven by impatience, and it's not necessarily, you never know how life would've turned out or what I, what path that, you know, would've gone down. But, um, I really do think it's important to, to, uh, to not be too impatient with your career. You know, learn as much as you can. Get as much as you can out of each opportunity while you're there. And appreciate that. And you know, usually when you do good work and do good things, it leads to, it leads to success.

Lan Elliott: 28:53

That's great. Thank you. Yeah. Gavin is lucky to have that letter. So I wanted to ask you one fun question because one of the things that we enjoy doing with our spouses when we get together is go out for great meals. And you recently moved to Milwaukee. And for anyone who lives in Milwaukee or is visiting Milwaukee, did have you found a favorite restaurant that you and your wife like to go to?

Michael Evans: 29:22

Uh, I have so, so there's lots of great restaurants in Milwaukee actually. You know, I moved here from Vegas, as you know, and, and Vegas is, you know, capital. Some people might argue New York, but in the US Vegas has pretty amazing restaurants, right? And. But they're not as authentic as, as you know, they're all replicas of someplace else. And one thing we really loved when we moved to Milwaukee was how authentic our restaurants are. We have very few chains, actually downtown. There's almost no chains, restaurants, um, so a lot of great restaurants here. We, uh, we operate a lot of great restaurants, but one, one of our favorites actually is a restaurant called Old Germantown. It's a, uh, it's a restaurant on, on 125 acre. And it's owned by family. They've lived on the farm for 35 years. They, they raised their kids there. And, um, uh, when they retired, um, Scott, um, one of the founders was, uh, in education. When he retired, he had this dream of building this restaurant on their farm, and he was passionate about, uh, making homemade sausages and homemade beer. And they built this beautiful restaurant, well, they opened it in November of 20, about the worst time that you could open a restaurant, right? Most restaurants were closing down. That's when they opened. And, uh, my wife Sheila had read about this, that it was gonna be opening in the paper. And we went, the opening day, fell in love with the restaurant. Um, and with the owners, we've become friends with the family and it's a spectacular, really authentic, amazing place with great food and great atmosphere. So, um, anyone that is visiting Milwaukee, they should definitely go visit old German.

Lan Elliott: 30:58

All right. Thank you. Thank you for that great tip, and I hope Mike and I can join you and Sheila there one day. Yeah. When we come out to visit. Absolutely. Well, I know I can always spend lots of time with you, but our time is getting towards the end, and so I wanted to ask you for one final piece of advice if you could share with our viewers, keeping in mind that d e I advisors mission is centered around empowering personal success. What, what final tidbit of advice would you offer our viewers who are looking to advance their careers?

Michael Evans: 31:32

So, May I, I, I hope this isn't too simple, right? But, but I think of a couple things. One, um, you know, keep learning, right? I, I touched on this a little bit earlier, uh, with intellectual curiosity, but keep learning going above and beyond, you know, become sub true subject matter experts in your field and, and, and, and other fields, right? And, and no more if you're in marketing, well learn more than just marketing, right? And if you're in. Learn beyond development. So, so learning everything you can, I think is really, is really critical, um, in the first place, you know. Second, I'd say, you know, put in the hard work, you know, demonstrate, uh, you know, your passion and your commitment and, and, and the expertise that you have. Um, and then, and then, you know, lastly, I'd say, you know, be a proactive networker and, and affiliative leader, as I talked about, you know, focus on building those strong relationships up, down and across organization as well as, you know, within the industry. And I think, you know, following those, those steps while it's, you know, obviously very high level, um, I think are really key to, to having a, a long and successful.

Lan Elliott: 32:45

Amazing advice. Thank you so much, Michael. I really appreciate you sharing your journey and your advice for how you manage to accomplish so much in your wonderful career. Not that you're done yet. No. But far from it. Far from it, absolutely. And

Michael Evans: 33:02

I appreciate

Lan Elliott: 33:03

it. Absolutely. We're so happy to have you on, and for our viewers, if you enjoyed this interview with Michael, we hope you'll join us on our website at d e i advisors.org for more great interviews. Thank you.

Michael Evans: 33:16

Thanks.